Tools and Weapons with Brad Smith

U.S. Ambassador Meg Whitman: Leading with the right questions

Episode Summary

Throughout her impressive career leading businesses, nonprofits, and now as the U.S. Ambassador to Kenya, Meg Whitman has been driven by a simple question: "What are we going to do about it?" This relentless focus on action propelled her as she transformed eBay from a fledgling startup into a global e-commerce powerhouse and guided her as CEO navigating HP through a high-stakes corporate split. In this episode, she shares how her mother's experience becoming a certified airplane mechanic during WWII instilled in her the courage to take on big challenges, like building diplomatic bridges in Africa’s burgeoning Silicon Savanah.

Episode Notes

Throughout her impressive career leading businesses, nonprofits, and now as the U.S. Ambassador to Kenya, Meg Whitman has been driven by a simple question: "What are we going to do about it?" This relentless focus on action propelled her as she transformed eBay from a fledgling startup into a global e-commerce powerhouse and guided her as CEO navigating HP through a high-stakes corporate split. In this episode, she shares how her mother's experience becoming a certified airplane mechanic during WWII instilled in her the courage to take on big challenges, like building diplomatic bridges in Africa’s burgeoning Silicon Savanah.

Click here for the episode transcript.

Episode Transcription

Brad Smith: I'm Brad Smith, and this is Tools and Weapons. On this podcast, I'm sharing conversations with leaders who are at the intersection of the promise and the peril of the digital age. We'll explore technology's role in the world as we look for new solutions for society's biggest challenges.

Meg Whitman: I always say we have two ears and one mouth, which probably means we should be listening about double the time that we're talking. I always have led by asking questions.

Brad Smith: That's Meg Whitman, the successful business and nonprofit leader who's now serving as the United States Ambassador to Kenya. Her hallmark bias for action is driven by a simple question, what are we going to do about this? In this episode, she shares how her mother's experience of becoming a certified mechanic during World War II instilled in her the courage to take on big challenges. We talk about what it takes to be an effective leader in building bridges and how Kenya, filled with entrepreneurial spirit, has become East Africa's new Silicon Savannah, giving it an incredibly bright future.

My conversation with Meg Whitman, coming up next on Tools and Weapons. The United States Ambassador to Kenya, Meg Whitman, thank you for joining me. I think you have one of the extraordinary careers of frankly, any business leader or just any leader of our generation. It's an extraordinary story that has brought you from growing up in New York to adulthood in California to now, East Africa as US Ambassador to Kenya. Is that a course in your life that you would've envisioned a decade ago living with your husband working in Nairobi?

Meg Whitman: No. Well, first of all, Brad, thank you for having me. I'm delighted to be on Tools and Weapons. I'll tell you a funny story. The embassy saw in my calendar Tools and Weapons, and they said, "What is that? We like the tools part. We don't like the weapons part."

Brad Smith: Made everyone nervous.

Meg Whitman: No, it's Brad Smith from Microsoft. It'll be fine. I'm delighted to be here. No, I never thought I would live in Nairobi. I didn't know much about Africa. I hadn't thought much about Africa, but it's been a fantastic and really interesting experience.

Brad Smith: What has most surprised you in your work as United States Ambassador there?

Meg Whitman: Well, I think so much of this is new for me. I never have worked for the United States government before and I'm now a government employee. I've never lived outside the United States for an extended period of time. I spent three months in China, but I've never lived outside the United States, and that's always interesting and didn't know much about Africa, had been to Kenya a couple of times. Understanding the Kenyan government, understanding Kenyan politics, Kenyan culture has been fascinating. I think the thing that has really surprised me is how dynamic Africa is, and in particular, the dynamism of Kenya. I think the narrative in the United States and maybe even in Europe about Africa is there's not a lot going on here. There's some real challenges on the continent, and actually, there's a lot going on here. I've really started to put together a narrative of why should American businesses invest in Africa and why specifically Kenya, and it's been a really interesting time.

Brad Smith: Well, I think it's fantastic. In part, because I think that Kenya really is such a center for technology innovation. It's become a hub for activity. I want to dive into all of that. Before we get to that, while it may seem unusual in some ways, I would say I think it runs into your family to go to unusual places and do unusual things. I want to start a little bit with your own story. Let's begin with maybe your mother who I might even refer to as mom who became a mechanic.

Meg Whitman: Yes.

Brad Smith: Tell us how that happened. Tell us that story.

Meg Whitman: Well, my mom was born in a different generation. She was born in 1920 and lived almost 90 years and was always an adventurer. She played girls organized sports before there were girls organized sports. During World War II, she wanted to join the war effort and there weren't a lot of roles for women. She went to the Red Cross, she was living in Boston and said, "I'd like to help." They said, "Great news. This class of women would like to send you to the South Pacific and this is where you can be of the most use." She got on a troop ship 30 days to the South Pacific and she gets to the base camp.

There's a thousand women on this ship, and the commander says, "What we really need is airplane mechanics and truck mechanics." My mother, I promise you, had never looked under the hood of anything. She said, "Well, that's where the need is greatest, that's what I'll do." Four years later, she was a fully certified airplane mechanic and a fully certified truck mechanic. I have an older brother, older sister. She said to us growing up, "If I can figure out how to be a mechanic, you guys can do anything."

Brad Smith: I think that's a wonderful inspiration. She not only inspired you with her own experience and her words, but literally she showed all three of you the country. Can you share a little bit of that experience? What was it like?

Meg Whitman: Well, when I was five going on six, and my older brother was eight years older than I am, my older sister, six years. She got together with her very best friend, and they took eight children under the age of 13 on a three-month camping trip through the United States in a Ford Econoline van with the pop-up where you could sleep in at night. We didn't stay in a hotel for three months. We camped in every major national park, and it really shaped my love for the outdoors, my love for being outdoors and obviously, now conservation. She showed us the United States of America over one summer. The dads who had to work, the dads came in for two weeks during the summer. The rest of the time, two women and eight kids under the age of 13. Can you imagine?

Brad Smith: That is hard to imagine. It's a wonderful experience and opportunity and I just think a great role model.

Meg Whitman: It shaped me, and it shaped my brother and sister too. We got to see the country as very few people in that day and age did and really made us appreciate the natural beauty and the incredible resources that this country has.

Brad Smith: Did growing up in that environment give for you a bit of a bias for the action that has always been one of your hallmarks?

Meg Whitman: I think probably so, but I also think it probably is just innate. There are people who just have to get stuff done. I was probably one of those people growing up. I was a competitive swimmer, did well academically. It's so interesting here now working for the State Department because my question is often, and what are we going to do about it?

Brad Smith: Let's go there. How does the State Department think about action?

Meg Whitman: Well, carefully. I think that's appropriate, Brad, in many ways. Because what you don't want to do is inadvertently create an international incident. There is an art and a craft to diplomacy, which I have really had to learn in the last year. I've been here just over a year. I came August 4th, or August 1st, a year ago. Then how they think about bringing in all the constituencies. It is something that we do in business, but in the end, in business, the CEO makes the decision, ultimately. Then the organization is expected to march forward. That's a little bit different because you've got so many different constituencies. You've got the United States, you've got different agencies in the United States government.

Brad Smith: What is it like to lead an embassy when you have people from so many different parts of the United States government?

Meg Whitman: Well, I have 34 different agencies here in Nairobi. This is the 10th largest embassy in the world. As I said, I've got state department employees, I've got Department of Defense, USAID, I have TSA. I'm the head of TSA here today. I've got population refugees and migration. I've got everybody. It's fascinating, because you really do see the challenge of knitting together all these different agencies and how you work as one team in embassy Nairobi. What's true, Brad, is while I am the coordinator for these 34 agencies, they all report up through their vertical line. The DOD, the defense attache reports to the DOD. The State Department, people all report up through the State Department. The population and refugee migration group, they go up through that group. I've got the United States Department of Agriculture here. They report up through there. I've got a treasury attache. In our language, it's a matrix organization. As you know from business matrix organizations, sometimes work in private firms and sometimes don't, but it works. I have to worry about inter-agency coordination.

Brad Smith: It's obviously very different from being the CEO of a company, and you've done that in different companies so well. Have you had to change your leadership style to lead this kind of matrix team?

Meg Whitman: A little bit, certainly. There's some commonalities here, which is what's the strategy? What are we trying to get done here? I thought one of Satya's most brilliant moves when he became CEO of Microsoft was cloud first, mobile first. Everyone understood it. The organization knew how to run after that focused areas. I think most of us in business believe focus is really important. I've tried to focus on achieving a small number of things, doing 100% on a small number of things as opposed to 50% on many things. That's true. What's different is in business, we pick our teams, don't we? I don't pick my teams.

They arrive and I'm like, "Hey, how you doing?" That's been a difference. Focus, accountability, making progress, communicating that is all similar to business. What's different, as I said, is it takes a little bit longer. There's different levels of approval that particularly for some things have to be obtained either within the embassy or in Washington. It's been different. It's been different, but I've enjoyed it. Again, more commonalities than differences, and you just have to be aware of when in Rome, you got to do a little bit like the Romans do.

Brad Smith: Well, let's talk about Kenya. It's such an extraordinary country. People I think in the United States or in Europe may think first and foremost about the geography, the nature, the preservation of that nature. Let's start with the people. You've noted quite rightly that Africa is the world's youngest continent. In some ways, maybe it's the oldest continent and the youngest continent at the same time. We've definitely found this at Microsoft. As you know, we have a large development center in Nairobi, more than 500 people. Tell us what you have found when it comes to Kenya, the people, and what it means for technology in particular?

Meg Whitman: Well, Kenya, as most of your listeners will know is in East Africa. It's on the Indian Ocean. The Port of Mombasa is the main entry point for goods and services coming through East Africa. It's a gateway to 500 million people. Kenya is a population of 55 million. A very young country, much like all of Africa. I will say it is a very entrepreneurial culture. Kenyans know how to get things done and they work very hard. It is English speaking because Britain was the colonial power here for so many years. The education system is strong, both primary, secondary and tertiary education.

They have become the tech center of East Africa. I would say largely because of M-PESA. M-PESA was developed in 2007 by Kenyans, and three years later, it was the largest mobile money network in the world. What Kenya did is they went from cash to mobile money. They skipped over credit cards, checks, money orders, you name it. They skipped over all of that, and now is over a billion dollars in revenue, over 350 billion in total payment volume, seven countries. This is the amazing thing, about 60% of Kenya's GDP goes through M-PESA.

Brad Smith: That is remarkable.

Meg Whitman: That then created an ecosystem of FinTech, agritech, all kinds of different technology, full stack engineering development centers, as you said that Microsoft has there. It has now the most robust venture capital community in East Africa. Nigeria has more venture capital, but as a percentage of GDP, Kenya is larger and growing faster. Then also has a couple of very good universities that have anchored the technology community here. Then frankly, Safaricom, which owns M-PRSA, and then some of the big American tech companies have done what HP did in Silicon Valley many years ago, which is seed talent to the startups. There's quite a robust startup community here. I think Kenya is certainly the tech leader in East Africa and could well be in a couple of years, the tech leader in all of Africa. Because they have by far and away the most developed ecosystem. They call it Silicon Savannah.

Brad Smith: It is. As you noted, I've found probably for a couple of decades now, going to one of the universities in Nairobi, you meet people of extraordinary talent. It's just so exciting, I think, to see this ecosystem emerging. When you think about where Kenya or East Africa is today, and then you say compare that to where Southeast Asia was say 20 years ago, do you see similarities?

Meg Whitman: I do. I think Africa in Toto is really the last big, largely untapped consumer market and really a place for people to move supply chains to in much the way we saw Southeast Asia 20 years ago. If you think about what's going on right now, supply chain diversification is so important. Because what we learned when Russia invaded the Ukraine, to have a single source of supply, whether it's for manufactured goods or for development centers, you have to have a diversified supply chain.

What you're seeing is people thinking, "Gee, if I am too focused on just China or Vietnam or Cambodia or Sri Lanka or Bangladesh or India, I've got to think about where else I should go." Kenya has the added advantage of 93% green energy. If you're moving from place A to place B and you're burning fossil fuels in place A for your electricity or your power, you can come to Kenya and it's 93% renewable, and you would go to an industrial park which had 100% green energy. Supply chain diversification and green energy I think really positions Kenya incredibly well in a world where everyone is rethinking their supply chain.

Brad Smith: Can you tell us a little bit about that green energy? What kind of energy is it and what led Kenya to develop it to such a degree?

Meg Whitman: Well, they are blessed. It is about 60% geothermal, and that's just an accident of their geology, but they took advantage of it. They've had geothermal plants here for the last 20 years. Because what they understood was, the power of green energy, they knew that if they were going to industrialize and the continent was going to industrialize, they had to do it in a different way than the US, Canada, France, Japan, Australia, China, that it couldn't be done on fossil fuels. It had to be done on green energy.

They really focused on geothermal. There's a great deal of wind here. There's a great deal of solar. That's how they're beginning to modernize agriculture. It's almost entirely rain-fed irrigation here, rain-fed agriculture, which is not going to work in the current situation of climate change. They've just come off four years of historic drought here. Think about it, if you're going to have to bring water to the farms and modernize, it has to be solar irrigation and can't be gasoline pumps. They're very forward-looking on solar and wind.

Brad Smith: This is also, I think, an interesting connection between your background, that exposure to the National Parks of America, to now a country with some of the most amazing national parks in the world, having to adapt to climate change. As you get out and experience those aspects of Kenya, what are you seeing?

Meg Whitman: Well, for anyone who has never been to Kenya, I mean, it's simply extraordinary. It has some of the most beautiful conservancies. The Mara, the Masai Mara is I think one of the seven wonders of the world. The animal density and population of everything from cheetahs to elephants to giraffes to all different kinds of antelope, to warthogs, you name it, it is an extraordinary Savannah. They already have about 13 to 17% of their land conserved, and their objective is to be at 30% by 2030. They pioneered a lot of conservation initiatives, one of which is community conservancies.

Because there is national parks, but every place can't be a national park. They've gotten the communities, the indigenous tribes and local communities to actually understand that their land is worth more as a conservancy than it is for potentially other uses like cattle grazing and things like that. It's been a remarkable success story. By the way, in the United States, USAID has helped with that movement, which is now about 20 years old.

Brad Smith: When we think about that, I mean, obviously your job today is to represent the United States of America and to advance the US relationship with Kenya. Tell us a little bit about how you take stock of the US Kenyan relationship today and what you're hoping as you continue to serve in Nairobi to bring to it.

Meg Whitman: Well, we've had a very long relationship with Kenya. We came here right after independence in 1964, and we've had an embassy here since that time. There's a very deep relationship between the United States military and the Kenyan Defense Force and the Kenyan Police Force. Because together, we fight violent extremism in Somalia. Somalia, as you probably know, is the home of Al-Shabaab, the largest Al-Qaeda affiliate in the world, very well financed. The United States embassy was bombed in 1998 on the same day that the Tanzanian Embassy was bombed, both by Al-Shabaab and over 300 people were killed. The threat is real here. It is a top 25 high threat post. I will say that the work between our military, the Kenyan Defense Force and the police is extraordinary. Also, our counter-terrorism units. There's a great degree of trust.

The United States has long been a big trading partner of Kenya, but this year, we became Kenya's largest export market, passing Uganda. There's about a billion and a half dollars of bilateral trade roughly balanced. Another thing that has helped that is AGOA, the African Growth and Opportunities Act that has about several hundred categories that can now be imported into the United States, Duty Free, one of which is apparel. You're starting to see tremendous movement from Southeast Asia, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Ethiopia, into Kenya. The good news about an apparel company is they hire a lot of people. Microsoft hires a lot of people too, but as a percentage of revenue, your number of employees are much less than a factory, whether it's an electronics factory or an apparel factory.

Factories are an important part of their journey through what we would call industrialization. Lots of ways to work together. The other thing I have learned about America being for the first time living outside of America, it does give you a different perspective. We are the most generous country in the world, whether it's humanitarian relief around food insecurity, whether it is early childhood education, you name it. HIV PEPFAR, HIV AIDS, and President Bush's PEPFAR program has been an extraordinarily effective program here. I think there's a lot of trust. I will say, Brad, that China has been more present on the continent in the last two decades than the United States of America. That's something that we're trying to do, is as you well know in business, half the battle is showing up.

Brad Smith: Absolutely. Well, what I also find interesting is literally the day you showed up last August also was an extraordinary historical milestone for Kenya, for democracy, for political stability. You've spoken a bit about this. What's your assessment of the state of democracy in Kenya?

Meg Whitman: Well, I would say that Kenya is certainly the most stable country in Africa and is probably the most robust democracy. They did have elections last summer, last August, which by many observers was the freest, fairest most transparent election in Kenya history. I think they're well on their way. It's a young democracy. You have to remember, they've only been a democracy since 1964, only a multi-party democracy since the 90s. It's young. As we now know, in America, democracies are fragile, aren't they?

Brad Smith: Yes. Whether they're young or old.

Meg Whitman: Young or old. I think we learned that on January 6th, didn't we? They have to be nurtured and they take time. Institutions take time to build. The hallmark of any democracy is the role of the judiciary, the rule of law, and they're doing a good job here, but there's more work to be done. I think the international community was very impressed. It was violence-free. At the time, power was transferred peacefully, which is the first time that's happened in a number of different elections. There's still work to be done as there is in every democracy. You've been here, and I think you're probably pretty impressed with what they've been able to put together.

Brad Smith: Absolutely. I've always come away from my trips to Kenya, not only impressed, but energized. I have to say, I mean just like you, I didn't have a lot of knowledge before I started going there. I think for most Americans, at least, what I found surprising was, as you put it, this entrepreneurial spirit. When people can achieve a lot with a little, which means that if you give them even more to work with, the future has such potential. At least that's the way I've always come away from each trip.

Meg Whitman: I agree with you. One thing that's been particularly interesting to me is because they solved one of the biggest problems on the internet, which is payments, before they solved e-commerce. In the United States, e-commerce started, remember Amazon and eBay, and there was really no way to pay. At eBay, you would send a check or a money order to the person that you had bought something from, and then you would get the check and money order. It would take 10 days to clear, and then you wouldn't be back in the market for 10 days.

Then we acquired PayPal, and that eased the entire, that was actually a second to IPO for eBay when we acquired PayPal. They solved the payments thing, and now they're building out e-commerce at a very fast rate. E-commerce has to be different, because most of rural Kenya, and when I mean rural, I mean outside of Nairobi, doesn't have street addresses, doesn't have mailboxes. You have to ship the goods to an agent in a town who will then say, "Oh, this is for X, Y, Z person." They will drop off that at that person's house or apartment or whatever. There's quite a bit of difference on how they have executed e-commerce, but it's been remarkable. It's been just remarkable.

Brad Smith: When you think about it, since time immemorial, people basically needed money, currency, in order to create something. I think in the world today, you actually need two things. You need money and you need technology. I think what you're describing is fascinating. Most of the world figured out the technology before figuring out the payments. It actually doesn't matter what order, perhaps. You just have to bring them both together, but it is a different path, isn't it?

Meg Whitman: It is a different path. The entrepreneurs here have been very good about figuring out how to adapt models from technology in many different countries to say, "Okay, what's going to work here in Kenya?" That's where you see the entrepreneurial spirit. You say, "Okay." They didn't just grab the eBay idea, they changed it in a way to uniquely suit Kenya. Now you're getting some, obviously, quite big businesses here. You've got enormous banking center here. This could also, I believe, be the financial capital of the entire continent. There's the infrastructure for a major financial center here. As you know from Microsoft's business, there's a lot of business to be done here with bigger companies as well as the startup community.

Brad Smith: Well, as we come to a close, I'd like to then step back and just reflect a little bit on what I regard as the extraordinary strands of your career and ask you to reflect upon them a little bit as well. When I think about a career in business, people can lead a startup or they can lead a large company, you've done both. In the tech sector, if you're really successful, you can be the CEO of a consumer tech company, like eBay. You can be the CEO of an enterprise tech company, like HP. You've done both. Even more broadly than that, I've always thought that fundamentally, there's three sectors, if you will, of any economy.

There's the private sector with business, there's the nonprofit sector, there's government. You've been the national board chair of Teach for America, so you have deep ties in the nonprofit sector. Now, you're getting, I guess, the triple crown. One of the things I sometimes reflect upon is people are quick to think about the differences. Think a little bit about the similarities as we think about how to bring people together to build bridges, to build on each other. What do you take away from the extraordinary combination of experiences you've had?

Meg Whitman: Well, thank you. You're very nice. It's been a fascinating career. I didn't lay it out that way. You probably don't know this, but when I went to Princeton as an undergraduate, I wanted to be a doctor.

Brad Smith: Yes, I did know that actually.

Meg Whitman: I took biology and chemistry and physics, and then I hit organic chemistry.

Brad Smith: That's what defines the doctors from everyone else.

Meg Whitman: I said, "Okay, what else we got?" Ended up being interested in business and majoring in economics. I think there's a couple of things. I started my career at Proctor and Gamble, then went to Bain and Company for about 10 years, then I went down to the Walt Disney Company, went back east to Hasbro, and then from Hasbro actually out to eBay. Part of the reason is I'm married to a physician. I'm married to a neurosurgeon. We were constantly trading off careers. I think there's a couple of commonalities. First of all, it's absolutely true, it's not motherhood and apple pie. As a leader, you are only as good as the people that you work with.

If you could only do one thing, work with the very best, most imaginative, smartest, and people who are fun to work with. Teams have always been an incredibly important part of my journey. I've had the privilege of working with some extraordinary people. I think the other thing is I always say we have two ears and one mouth, which probably means we should be listening about double the time that we're talking. I always have led by asking questions, and I'm famous for saying, someone will say something and I'll say, "What do we think about that?"

Brad Smith: That's a great question.

Meg Whitman: What do we think about that? That listening and synthesizing and double-checking. Then as a leader, you have to make a decision, whether you're in an NGO, whether you're at a startup, whether you're at Microsoft, whether you're in the United States government. Someone needs to have accountability to make the decision and then be accountable for that decision. You know from your work in different companies, sometimes people don't want to make a decision. Sometimes there are more people who can say no than who can say yes. That's something I've learned along the way.

That was true at Teach for America as much as it was true at eBay and HP. Then thirdly, is everyone in the company has got to be, or in the organization, has got to be able to articulate the strategy. What are we trying to do here? What are we trying to accomplish? How will we know if we've been successful? It can't just be revenues and return on a vested capital. It has to be, what are we trying to do here? I come back to cloud first, mobile first. It was genius, understandable. Everyone knew it, and everyone had to sort of go along with that, or they didn't maybe have a role at Microsoft. At eBay, it was how do you help people to be successful doing what they love?

Brad Smith: I think that's a wonderful thought. Just one last closing question, if I could. I think you've provided a great perspective for many Americans or Europeans or others who may not have been to Kenya recently or ever. I know that we'll have people in Kenya who listen to this as well. What do you want to leave them with as they think about the United States and Kenya's relationship with our country?

Meg Whitman: Well, I think a couple of things. One is, I think, and I think the United States thinks, that Kenya has incredible potential, and Kenya really matters to Africa. Africa is a continent of change, and Kenya is a beacon of a strong country with democratic values, with tremendous economic opportunity ahead of it. I want the Kenyans to know how much we believe in Kenya, and that's important to them. How much do we believe in Kenya? That this notion of bilateral trade is very important because Kenya today, 70% of their people work in what I call the informal economy. That's agriculture, the stands on the side of the road. Ultimately, that 70%, just as happened in so many other countries, that 70% that work in agriculture, it ultimately has to be 70% that work in the formal sector.

That's jobs with paychecks, with some benefits, steady paychecks that allow people to have a steady source of income to pay for their kids to go to school. For their kids to go to university, for them to feed their families and have decent housing and lives. I think we can be great partners with Kenya on that journey. It's not just about economic growth and development, it's about education and healthcare and safety. I think we're excellent partners there. What I always say when I'm asked about China is I always say, we just want to give a set of alternatives to Kenya. We're not here to say, you must do business with the US and not China or anyone else, but we want to put together the best offer. The best offer, and the best ideas for the future. If we do that, like in business, it'll come along. I'm so admiring of the Kenyan people. I'm so admiring of what they've been able to accomplish thus far. I think the future is very bright for both Kenya and Americans as we think about what we can do together.

Brad Smith: Well, thank you. I think a great ambassador has an opportunity to help bring two countries and two peoples closer together. You're obviously focused on doing that. I can't imagine anyone better to serve in this important time as the United States ambassador to Kenya. Ambassador Whitman, Meg Whitman, thank you for being with us today.

Meg Whitman: Thank you very much.

Brad Smith: You've been listening to Tools and Weapons, with me, Brad Smith. If you enjoyed today's show, please follow us wherever you like to listen. Our executive producers are Carol Ann Browne and Aaron Thiese. This episode of Tools and Weapons was produced by Corina Hernandez and Jordan Rothlein. This podcast is edited and mixed by Jenny Cataldo, with production support by Sam Kirkpatrick at RUN Studios. Original music by Angular Wave Research. Tools and Weapons is the production of Microsoft, made in partnership with Listen.